Great simplification pulsing lines

Ep 117  |  Geoffrey West

Geoffrey West: “Metabolism and the Hidden Laws of Biology”

Check out this podcast

TGS117 Geoffrey West The Great Simplification

Show Summary

On this episode, physicist Geoffrey West joins Nate to discuss his decades of work on metabolic scaling laws found in nature and how they apply to humans and our economies. As we think about the past and future of societies, there are patterns that emerge independently across cultures in terms of resource use and social phenomena as the size of a city grows. Does Kleiber’s law, which describes the increasingly efficient use of energy as an animal gets larger – also apply to human cities? How have humans deviated from this rule through excess social consumption beyond a human body’s individual metabolic needs? What could we learn from these scaling laws to adjust our communities to be more aligned with the biophysical realities of energy and resource consumption? Can an understanding of social metabolism impact our social metabolism?

About Geoffrey West

Geoffrey West is the Shannan Distinguished Professor and former President of the Santa Fe Institute and an Associate Senior Fellow of Oxford University’s Green-Templeton College. West is a theoretical physicist whose primary interests have been in fundamental questions ranging across physics, biology and the social sciences. His work is motivated by the search for unifying principles and the “simplicity underlying complexity”. His research includes metabolism, growth, aging & death, sleep, cancer, ecosystems, innovation and the accelerating pace of life. Most recently he has been developing a science of cities and companies, including the challenge of long-term global sustainability of the anthroposphere. He is the author of the best-selling book Scale; The Universal Laws of Growth, Innovation, Sustainability, and the Pace of Life in Organisms, Cities, Economies, and Companies.

In French, we have a motto that says that a simple drawing is often better than a long explanation. Jean-Marc Jancovici Carbone 4 President

That’s very understandable because with left atmosphere thinking, one of the problems is that you see everything as a series of problems that must have solutions. Iain McGilchrist Neuroscientist and Philosopher

We can’t have hundreds and hundreds of real relationships that are healthy because that requires time and effort and full attention and awareness of being in real relationship and conversation with the other human. Nate Hagens Director of ISEOF

This is the crux of the whole problem. Individual parts of nature are more valuable than the biocomplexity of nature. Thomas Crowther Founder Restor

Show Notes & Links to Learn More

00:00 – Geoffrey West works + info, Scale; The Universal Laws of Growth, Innovation, Sustainability, and the Pace of Life in Organisms, Cities, Economies, and Companies,

00:59 – Kleiber’s Law

03:30 – Max Kleiber

05:35 – Logarithmic scale

08:02 – Newton’s Laws

10:51 – ~100 trillion cells inside humans

12:55 – Keiber’s law and forests

14:01 – Energy requirements of ‘the internet’

14:17 – Anthroposphere

16:55 – Exosomatic metabolic rate

17:38 – The Blue Whale is the biggest animal to ever exist

23:01 – Urban Superlinearly Scaling of social metabolism

25:39 – Howard T. Odum, Maximum Power Principle

28:40 – Urban Sublinear Scaling of Infrastructure

29:45 – Dopamine

30:31 – Complexity of the human metabolism

31:15 – New York population and patents vs Santa Fe population and patents

32:26 – Economics for the future – Beyond the superorganism

32:44 – Ronald Wright, Marco Polo, Hernán Cortés

35:45 – Eusocial

39:54 – Degrowth

41:25 – Superlinear social scaling requires the constant speeding up the pace of life

43:55 – Jesus Christ, Mahatma Gandhi, Martin Luther King Jr.

52:32 – Open and Closed Systems

55:23 – Developed countries are 80% urbanized

58:35 – 15 minutes city

1:01:33 – E.O. Wilson

1:02:49 – 80/20 Rule

1:16:57 – Pre-Colombian cities followed these scaling laws

1:17:25 – Resource use through the rise and fall of Rome

1:18:02 – Metabolism of companies

1:21:40 – Why do humans live as long as they do

1:27:33 – Reducing your metabolism would increase your life (fasting)

1:39:20 – Why We Die

Download transcript
Back to episodes
Rod SchoonoverThe National Security Risks We’re Not Prepared ForWith Rod SchoonoverThe Great SimplificationEp 183 | Rod Schoonover

National security concerns have been the invisible hand guiding governance throughout recorded history. In the 20th century, it was defined by a country versus country dynamic: whichever nation was the strongest and most strategic was also the safest. But today, our biggest national security threats don’t come from opposing nations – they are “actorless threats” that emerge from the breakdown of the complex systems we all depend on – from the stability of our planetary systems to our intricately complex and fragile global supply chains. In this unprecedented landscape, what is required of us in order to keep our citizens safe?

Watch nowJun 18, 2025
Movie Re-ReleaseThe Systems Science Behind Our Global CrisesWith Nate HagensThe Great SimplificationEp 182 | Nate Hagens

Three years ago, my team and I created a 30-minute movie that provides a comprehensive systems analysis of the human predicament—spanning energy, economics, ecology, and behavioral psychology. This beautifully animated film aims to help viewers understand the interconnected crises defining our era.

Watch nowJun 13, 2025
Globalization End GameHelena Norberg-Hodge HeadshotGlobalization End GameWith Helena Norberg-HodgeThe Great SimplificationEp 181 | Helena Norberg-Hodge

Over the last few decades, humanity has globalized everything – from food production and supply chains to communication and information systems – making countries, businesses, and individuals more connected and reliant on each other than ever before. Yet, with this increased interconnectedness comes more complexity and fragility. What have we lost through the globalization process, and how might we fortify our communities by investing in local economies?

Watch nowJun 11, 2025

Subscribe to our Substack

Please enable JavaScript in your browser to complete this form.

The Institute for the Study of Energy and Our Future (ISEOF) is a 501(c)(3) non-profit corporation, founded in 2008, that conducts research and educates the public about energy issues and their impact on society.

Support our work
Get in touch
x